RRB ID help please

[oldremguy]

JReed,

The NYS Model Rolling Block Rifle that you have is 45-70. Remington did make some of these guns in 45-70, don't know if a small lot was sold to New York State National Guard or not, or if they were just sold on the commercial market. I have two NYS model rifles that are chambered in 45-70 in my collection. One is like yours, it has barrel band springs on the forearm and a sling swivel on the trigger guard. The second one was made at a later date, having the last patent date of 1874, it has no barrel band springs on the forearm and the sling swivel is not on the trigger guard, but is on the bottom of the butt stock. Have seen 3 of these rifles listed on different gun auction sites or different dealer web sites over the last few years. They are a hard gun to come across.
Hope this information helps answer some of your questions.

Have a good day,
Matt

[ehull]

I concur with Matt. These were offered for sale in the late 1880s in Lamberson catalogs for civilian sale as the "New York State Model." Though the .45-70 caliber isn't mentioned it is often observed on these commercial market rifles (which are scarce). Ed Hull

[oldremguy]

JReed,

Don't let the lack of a cartouch on the stock drive you batty. Some of the stocks on the New York State rifles had field replacements put on them. I have a photo of company D, 12th NY, in Buffalo, in August 23, 1892 at a railroad yard and one of the members of the unit, you can see the guns receivers tangs in the photo, because he broke the butt stock of the rifle and has tied to the barrel with his sling. So they had to replace the stocks now and then.
As for the painted # 25 on the butt stock of your gun, I would agree that it is a rack number but not for the National Guard. They usually stamped a small number on the Butt plate or stock, never seen a painted rack number in any photos of the New York National guard that I have in my collect or on any rifle that I have seen at gun shows or on the web. Been collecting them for 20 years now. I have about nine photo's of sons of civil war veterans with NYS Model Rifles that I believe are chambered in 45-70, they match the 2nd type of NYS rifle in my collection with no barrel band springs and having the sling swivel on the bottom of the butt stock and not on the triger guard. So your rifle may of belonged to a similar group.

Will pull my guns from the safe this weekend and slug the bores. Have shot cast .458 bullets in the past in my 45-70's.

Matt

[oldremguy]

JReed,

Sorry to hear that you haven't heard back from the gunsmith.
I pulled my 2 NYS Model rifles in 45-70, out of the safe today.
One of them slugged out at .455 and the 2nd was .457 in diameter.
The only bullet mold that I have for the 45-70 is made by Lyman #45193 which casts a .458 dia. bullet at 405 grains. Can't help you with a load, haven't had a time to work up a load for them, to many other projects going on. Have shot some of my NYS model rifles in 50-70, using 68 grs of Black Powder and 52 grs of Pyrodex select, obtained 1-inch groups off the bench at 50 yards. Have found out that the 50-70 has less recoil then the 45-70.
If you want to try to shoot a 500 gr. bullet, you should check out Buffalo Arms. They sell
different types of cast bullets, that way you can try different weights to see what will work best in your rifle.

Hope that helps some.
Matt

[Rikkn]

I thought all NY Militia RRB's were 50-70, not 45-70...... I have just gotten one, Rem Historical Dept is a bit baffled as to the cartouche. Has all the hallmarks of a NY saddle ring carbine, in 50-70, but the cartouche is "USI", then "56", then the initials "EK".......... Anyone have any ideas on this one ?

[chugachmt]

I have the exact same model NY model 1877 45/70 rolling block with a different number painted on the stock. I bought it years ago from a county sheriff in Ada Michigan. Mine has a Buffington sight, but a standard edwards sigh fits also. It may have been a national guard rifle, a personal rifle bought on the commercial market, or possibly used by some militia or cadet company It shoots very well with both the lyman 385 grain ,and the 405 grain lazer cast bullet ( 1 1/2 to 2 1/2 inches at 100 yds.) using the trapdoor loads in the Accurate Arms powder manual.