I have a Springfield "army " rolling block action in good functional condition. I just bought a nearly new remington zouave Italian replica with out a lock. I would like to marry them and make a zouave rolling block like I saw in the Remington museum in Ilion.
I would like suggestions of a shop that could reline and chamber and put the barrel and action together. I seem to remember seeing one on line that did muzzleloading barrel stretching and relineing that also handled chambering and fitting actions but I can't find it. I would also like suggestions as to whether I need to go in 50/70 or could I consider 58 centerfire. In a way 20 guage intrigues me but I don't know if there is a way to make it fit the action.
Any thoughts appreciated.
Scott in Savannah
rolling block project
Re: rolling block project
Why not chamber it for the .58 CF like some of the original conversions? Although these may have been RF. Still, a .58 Zouave roller would be way cool. I have been contemplating just such a project as yours.
Re: rolling block project
If $ are not a consideration the .58 Berdan would be authentic. The most compatible case for the .58 is the Bertram 577-500 3 1/8 Nitro. It retails for $103.99/20 from Graff. Huntington does not carry it any longer. I once tried to use a brass shot shell but was unable to swage down the base enough for it to chamber. Also, they were Berdan primed. A .50-70 would be much easier on the wallet.
Re: rolling block project
I had Jim Dubell at Delta Gun Shop (link) reline and rechamber my 1875 #1 Remington rolling block .38 Long rimfire target/sporter rifle. The bore was unshootable, the metal finish was completely gone, and the stocks had been charred in a cabin fire in about 1915. In addition to the reline/rechamber in .357 Mag I also had him restore the exterior finish on the metal. We case colored the receiver, trigger guard, and butt plate, and blued everything else. I obtained new quarter-sawn walnut wood from Treebone Carving in NM (link) and rough fitted it myself. Jim did the final fit and finish on the new wood.
The modifications/repairs included converting the breech block to center fire, modifying the extractor for .357 Mag, installing the liner (from TJ's in KY) and rechambering, sharpening all corners and removing dents and pitting, filling a sling dovetail on the underside of the barrel, refurbishing the original iron sights, replacing stripped and damaged screws, and applying an 8 coat oil finish to the new wood.
Jim created many of the pieces he used from scratch. Jim is a master craftsman. I am thrilled with his work on my great grandfather's rifle. It was in very poor condition, but Jim restored it perfectly. The fit and finish of all the pieces are perfect, and it is once again a thing of beauty. It is also a joy to shoot and performs perfectly. Delta Gun Shop is a rare find and I would trust Jim with any work I wanted done in the future. He presently has another of my firearms for restoration. Jim's rates are more than reasonable and I highly recommend him. The liner and rechamber work were in the neighborhood of $400. Refinishing the metal and wood was about $700. General repairs, fitting, and modifications were about $700 (includes $250 for 90% inletted wood from Treebone). Altogether, the nearly turnkey restoration from wreck to piece of art was about $1800, which compares very favorably with the price of a (IMHO) butt-ugly Pedersoli reproduction.
Here are some examples of the type of work Jim has done (link). You can reach Jim directly on the phone at 509-684-5855. His phone hours are noon to 1:30 pm PDT. He's been amazingly informative (he really knows his antique rifles), patient, and just a nice guy over the many months we've worked on this project. Shipping via UPS 2nd day air has been quick and secure. This has been a great experience.
The modifications/repairs included converting the breech block to center fire, modifying the extractor for .357 Mag, installing the liner (from TJ's in KY) and rechambering, sharpening all corners and removing dents and pitting, filling a sling dovetail on the underside of the barrel, refurbishing the original iron sights, replacing stripped and damaged screws, and applying an 8 coat oil finish to the new wood.
Jim created many of the pieces he used from scratch. Jim is a master craftsman. I am thrilled with his work on my great grandfather's rifle. It was in very poor condition, but Jim restored it perfectly. The fit and finish of all the pieces are perfect, and it is once again a thing of beauty. It is also a joy to shoot and performs perfectly. Delta Gun Shop is a rare find and I would trust Jim with any work I wanted done in the future. He presently has another of my firearms for restoration. Jim's rates are more than reasonable and I highly recommend him. The liner and rechamber work were in the neighborhood of $400. Refinishing the metal and wood was about $700. General repairs, fitting, and modifications were about $700 (includes $250 for 90% inletted wood from Treebone). Altogether, the nearly turnkey restoration from wreck to piece of art was about $1800, which compares very favorably with the price of a (IMHO) butt-ugly Pedersoli reproduction.
Here are some examples of the type of work Jim has done (link). You can reach Jim directly on the phone at 509-684-5855. His phone hours are noon to 1:30 pm PDT. He's been amazingly informative (he really knows his antique rifles), patient, and just a nice guy over the many months we've worked on this project. Shipping via UPS 2nd day air has been quick and secure. This has been a great experience.
Last edited by Floop on Thu Sep 11, 2008 10:51 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Floop
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logcabin48
Re: rolling block project
Jim sounds like a great resource. I was hoping to bring this one in at basement prices. Not always the best idea. I do remember looking at a web site of a guy who stretches and relining of barrels for nssa shooters and he indicated he did chambering and action fitting for black powder guns also. I can't find the site again.
For this gun starting with italian wood and the craftsmanship of a repo I think the most I want to attempt would be to line if I decide to then chamber and fit. The possibility of re doing the finish of the action I am not sure about . I believe they were in the white or were they case hardened????? I believe the pins, blocks and screws were blued.
I have been thinking of this for about 20 years. It is exciting to think about getting it done.
Scott
For this gun starting with italian wood and the craftsmanship of a repo I think the most I want to attempt would be to line if I decide to then chamber and fit. The possibility of re doing the finish of the action I am not sure about . I believe they were in the white or were they case hardened????? I believe the pins, blocks and screws were blued.
I have been thinking of this for about 20 years. It is exciting to think about getting it done.
Scott
Re: rolling block project
I think I said TJ's is in NJ, but I just found the contact info and it's actually in KY. No website, so call and tell him what you need:
TJ's Enterprises
3652 Neltner Rd
Alexandria, KY 41001
(859) 635-5560
You can call and order the exact length and caliber you want. It runs about $4 per inch. Mine was $130 for .357 at 30".
The $550 I quoted was for Jim to do the relining, relocate the firing pin to centerfire, and the chambering work. The barrel liner was $150.00 with shipping. The installation and chambering were $250, so about $400 of the $550 was actually the liner and rechambering. So it's not as expensive as it looks at first glance.
The receiver, trigger guard, and butt plate were all case colored (hardened). Everything else is blued.
Let me repeat that this was a restoration, not simply repairs or modifications. A big chunk of the $1200 for the metal work was the labor of draw filing every surface to resharpen the corners and remove pitting, repairing threads and screws, and peening out any dents. I think about $800 would have covered simply relining, rechambering for .357 Mag, and refinishing the metal as it was. But like you, I had waited a lot of years (more like 50) to get this rifle in firing condition, and I wanted to do it first class. That's why I hired a true craftsman and artist.
BTW, you cannot tell either at the breech or the crown that my barrel has been relined. It's 4160 steel and the seams are invisible. The liner also strengthens the barrel and allows the use of modern higher pressure cartridges.
Another option for you through Jim (he also owns Clearwater Reboring) would be to have your barrel bored and re-rifled to a larger caliber. That was about $350 if I'm remembering correctly, and would include rechambering. I would call and talk to him, even if you think you want to do it all yourself.
TJ's Enterprises
3652 Neltner Rd
Alexandria, KY 41001
(859) 635-5560
You can call and order the exact length and caliber you want. It runs about $4 per inch. Mine was $130 for .357 at 30".
The $550 I quoted was for Jim to do the relining, relocate the firing pin to centerfire, and the chambering work. The barrel liner was $150.00 with shipping. The installation and chambering were $250, so about $400 of the $550 was actually the liner and rechambering. So it's not as expensive as it looks at first glance.
The receiver, trigger guard, and butt plate were all case colored (hardened). Everything else is blued.
Let me repeat that this was a restoration, not simply repairs or modifications. A big chunk of the $1200 for the metal work was the labor of draw filing every surface to resharpen the corners and remove pitting, repairing threads and screws, and peening out any dents. I think about $800 would have covered simply relining, rechambering for .357 Mag, and refinishing the metal as it was. But like you, I had waited a lot of years (more like 50) to get this rifle in firing condition, and I wanted to do it first class. That's why I hired a true craftsman and artist.
BTW, you cannot tell either at the breech or the crown that my barrel has been relined. It's 4160 steel and the seams are invisible. The liner also strengthens the barrel and allows the use of modern higher pressure cartridges.
Another option for you through Jim (he also owns Clearwater Reboring) would be to have your barrel bored and re-rifled to a larger caliber. That was about $350 if I'm remembering correctly, and would include rechambering. I would call and talk to him, even if you think you want to do it all yourself.
Floop
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logcabin48
Re: rolling block project
I will see what the replica I got on gunbroker looks like and will give Jim a call. you are right he is in the ball park price wise. I have only been waiting 20 years on this so I guess I am willing to shop around. I have found with project guns that I usually would have been farther ahead to have just bought something on the high end. This one I would feel I could take it to the field and not be ruining a great antique. I will let folks know how it goes.
scott in savannah
scott in savannah
Re: rolling block project
Please do let us know how it goes with Jim. I have been extremely pleased with his prices, quality, and attitude. I'd be very surprised if you had a different experience.
Floop